Discussion about this post

User's avatar
CRT's avatar

Some great content and reasoning here, and much that I’d like to respond to as someone who reads this passage as more comfortably supporting the Reformed view…but I’ll spare you many of my thoughts and limit my response to two.

First, you write: “He puts it differently a few verses later, when he says that if the recipients do not continue in faith and in God’s kindness, “you also will be cut off” (11:22). Note the significance of these verses. The apostle Paul entertains and warns about the real possibility that people who are justified by faith may, at some point, be cut off and not spared. Those verses make me Arminian.”

I can see how vv 17-25 might suade one towards Arminianism if they read them that way. However, I am curious how an Arminian would read the line a few verses later, where Paul writes “For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable.” Would he see an argument from Paul—implicit, though unstated—that there is a distinction between God’s irrevocable collective call and his revocable individual call? I find that less than persuasive, though I find the solely collectivist reading of the golden chain similarly unpersuasive (in the same way I would find a solely collective reading of Jesus’ high priestly prayer unpersuasive, notwithstanding the plurals: certainly there is a collective intent there, but surely not ONLY a collective intent—surely there is a prayer by Jesus, for example, that both the church AND the individual are to be sanctified by truth, that the Father’s love be both in the Church and in the individual? That collective church is comprised inescapably of individual members…there is no collective other than the membership that constitutes it. So, back to the question: how does an Arminian deal with verse 29? Saying “the parts that deal with unconditional election are collective, and the parts that deal with conditional election are individual” seems rather more like fitting the text into a prefabbed framework than drawing principles from the text.

Secondly, you also write: “To the contrary, the apostle portrays individual entrance into ultimate and final salvation as conditioned upon continued faith in Christ.” There’s a lot that comes to mind here—including thinking of the more “robust” meaning of pistis, which includes fidelity, faithfulness, not mere belief. I think such a robust definition actually supports the point you’re making: it’s not a one-time “belief” in some proposition that saves, one might say, but (something perhaps more like) fidelity to a Person, or a “living faithfulness” like James describes. But regardless of how we define pistis, my Reformed bent would counter your claim and stately plainly that our (collective, individual, whatever) entrance into ultimate and final salvation is conditioned first and foremost (and preeminently, one is tempted even to say exclusively) on one thing, the faithful work of Christ. What matters my choice in light of the choice of God to become, and die as, Man? It matters much like a spark in the path of a forest fire—real, yes, but relatively insignificant and soon to be subsumed. And who knows whether it be sparked by the match strike of an outside actor or is merely a burning ember cast from the advancing firestorm? The Bible clearly speaks of, calls us to, encourages us in our faith…but it is a faith the author and perfecter of which is none other than Christ. Whether the Christian can fail to continue in their faith or not, it is not our stamina or steadfastness that saves—“we are more than conquerors through him who loved us,” as Paul said a little earlier, through HIM who loved us. And as he said elsewhere, “It is no longer I who live, but Christ who lives in me. It is no longer I who live, but Christ who lives in me.” Whether it’s labeled individual election or not, the life of Christ in the redeemed has no rival in heaven or on earth or under the earth that can defeat it…this seems to be a fairly consistent testimony of Paul.

Brian Gillispie's avatar

Well done writing this one, Matt! One of my dear friends is going to seminary at Beeson and is attending your church. His name is Ryan Burk.

3 more comments...

No posts

Ready for more?